Perfumes

[gegarrenton]

Those bottles were corked though, correct?.

Ha! Indeed they were.

So this raises the question of how much the changes in the aromatic compounds in scent depend on aerobic/oxidative reactions and how much on anaerobic ones or on light or heat. And how much the exposed surface area of liquid in a closed bottle (tester or splash) is actually affected by the contact with air over time. Naturally the agitation of splashing will expose new surface to the air; how much difference does that make?

I'm all ears.

It's a interesting question to be sure. I don't think that science is going to drop what they are doing to indulge all our questions about the finer points of fragrance either, but maybe there is an intrepid chemist of good taste that is out there! I can only speak from my conversations of those in the industry and my own personal experience. Different compounds react to different things, so it's pretty complex and super difficult to pin down hard and fast cause and effect. Just as a good fragrance has a very nuanced nose, it has very nuanced properties!

I'm not telling anyone not to give the old fragrance a shot, but I personally couldn't recommend it. I'll happily send along a decanted bit of old Guerlain to anyone who wants to do some A/B testing on their own.

[couch]

Different compounds react to different things, so it's pretty complex and super difficult to pin down hard and fast cause and effect. Just as a good fragrance has a very nuanced nose, it has very nuanced properties.

Precisely my point. Your offer is very generous--too late for me, alas.

As one data point, after five or six years in my closed medicine cabinet away from light, my Tabac Blond pure parfum from the urns, in the stopper bottle, is about 80% used, and no doubt somewhat more concentrated from slight evaporation of alcohol. The color of the remaining juice is darker, and the scent has definitely not turned in any negative way--if anything it's richer. This is from before the latest reformulation, so presumably more natural essences involved. I'm wearing it today with gratitude as temperatures head down to 13 degrees F tonight in Philadelphia.

The Vetiver de Guerlain pictured in my earlier link appears to be in very good condition. Presumably stored in the box (so away from light) in Canada (so minimal overheating), with the sealed atomizer. I'd anticipate it should be in decent shape. I'll report when it arrives. It still may not be my favorite vetiver, even if perfectly fresh--in which case it will be available . . . .

[Dr T]

Im still with Shay and Blue, they sell all of their products in a small travel size - it always seems so fresh; just need to find a way to stop my wife using it (Blood Oranges)

[Gido]

It seems that my previous reply somehow got lost. This is the gist of it,

Couch, congratulations with you purchase. It checks all the boxes,

- tester bottle
- with box
- full
- right colour

You've got a genuine piece of old world luxury coming your way. They don't make them like this anymore.

[Gido]

On perfume preservation.

No-one knows more about this subject than the people who created the Osmotheque. They keep the perfume in an aluminum container at a constant temperature of 12 degrees celsius, filled up with argon to remove oxygen.
These substances are meant to be kept for eternity.

The worst offender is UV light.

So it's always good if you buy a old perfume if the box is there. People will generally not keep the box if they are not going to use it. Tester bottles are a good sign too, they have usually been stored under decent conditions by people in the business. A tester bottle, especially if it comes with it's box and cardboard roll 'cap', will reduce any change that it might be a fake.

Perfume that has spoiled usually shows it by it's color, though a darker perfume is often not spoiled but just partly evaporated, you will see this often with older stoppered bottles. Introducing some 95% pure lab grade/odorless ethanol (not the denatured stuff you can buy at drug stores!) can help in these cases.

I have seen these old bottles that have turned. And in fact, I think it's not that bad. What you will get, is a nail varnish type odor that will be present for a minute or so. This uninviting, fleeting opening is a bit of a turn off, but once you get past it, all will be well again. The top notes will have some damage, and will partly be distorted by a unattractive odor, but the structure remains intact. Still, just don't ever buy a bottle that you suspect might pose a risk because it seems it has not been stored properly.

[Gido]

As one data point, after five or six years in my closed medicine cabinet away from light, my Tabac Blond pure parfum from the urns, in the stopper bottle, is about 80% used, and no doubt somewhat more concentrated from slight evaporation of alcohol. The color of the remaining juice is darker, and the scent has definitely not turned in any negative way--if anything it's richer.

Evaporation, yes, it happens especially in stoppered bottles. I don't mind it that much, but I am of the old school.

For me, a proper perfume is build like a pyramid: it starts with it's basenotes, it is then modified by the middle or heart notes. Top notes are meant to mask certain unwanted elements and make the whole thing attractive from the start, to me they are the finishing touch.

Today, things seem to work the other way round, upside down. A lot of thought and money goes into that moment when most consumers decide to buy or not, the first impression. After that, unfortunately, it goes downhill. The decent ones go down with dignity, the terrible ones look like roadkill. Very few are great.

The Vetiver de Guerlain pictured in my earlier link appears to be in very good condition. Presumably stored in the box (so away from light) in Canada (so minimal overheating), with the sealed atomizer. I'd anticipate it should be in decent shape. I'll report when it arrives. It still may not be my favorite vetiver, even if perfectly fresh--in which case it will be available . . . .

Live with it for a while. No-one can guarantee that you will love it. I used to know a man who preferred Carven. But at least, you can say you have tried it while you could. And I'm sure someone else will be glad to take it off your hands. It's a classic.

[uppercase]

Yes, perfumes turn.
They don't age well.
Best to get fresh.
As for vintage, well, they're nice but still…not what they were in their youth.

What are you wearing these cold winter months …??

[Rob O]

In these straitened times
one looks to the past
for reassurance, for solace
and experiences that last.

creed original vetiver.

[couch]

Thanks for the good wishes, Gido, and for the pointers.

Evaporation, yes, it happens especially in stoppered bottles. I don't mind it that much, but I am of the old school.

Likewise.

For me, a proper perfume is build like a pyramid: it starts with it's basenotes, it is then modified by the middle or heart notes. Top notes are meant to mask certain unwanted elements and make the whole thing attractive from the start, to me they are the finishing touch.

I agree. I always wait for the drydown before deciding on a purchase. When I haven't waited long enough, I've made mistakes.

Today, things seem to work the other way round, upside down. A lot of thought and money goes into that moment when most consumers decide to buy or not, the first impression. After that, unfortunately, it goes downhill. The decent ones go down with dignity, the terrible ones look like roadkill. Very few are great.

Indeed. I lost my enthusiasm for Linda Pilkington's Zizan because the opening, which reminds me of Juicy Fruit chewing gum, persists for a fairly long time, and by the time the base comes through it's no longer compelling. When she was developing it, she told me she was trying to combine vintage Eau Sauvage, which she said was her favorite men's scent of all time, with the most intense vetivers she could source. At first I was swayed, but I just don't think the structure works.

Live with it for a while. No-one can guarantee that you will love it. I used to know a man who preferred Carven. But at least, you can say you have tried it while you could. And I'm sure someone else will be glad to take it off your hands. It's a classic.

I'll report back.

Cheers.

[culverwood]

It's always down to personal opinion but Linda's Zizan is my number one choice.

[couch]

It's always down to personal opinion but Linda's Zizan is my number one choice.

Yes, and skin chemistry. I think it's just not right on me. I was enthusiastic at first, and then found myself being disappointed. I kept hoping I'd like it better with time, but after a couple of years it just hasn't happened. I have a lot of respect for Linda's work, but this one just doesn't hang together on me. I'm glad to hear it works better for you.

[rodes]

What are you wearing these cold winter months …??

I am fairly basic. Endymion for winter evenings and TOB Sandalwood in the mornings. For warm weather, Floris 89 day and night.

[couch]

Tabac Blond usually. In milder damp weather, Green Irish Tweed; Schiaparelli Arrogance Uomo in cool dry weather. In really cold weather Bel Ami offers warmth and elegance, but regrettably it doesn't work well on my skin. Same with Ormonde Man.

I'm still searching for go-to warm season scents. Last couple of years I've worn Quercus, but I'm finding the floral component too strong for my taste now. So far I'm liking Voyage d'Hermes for summer—lighter, with less sillage but reasonable persistence. I nurse my remaining Puig vetiver and have hopes for the Guerlain vetiver, both for warmer weather. Terre d'Hermes works well on me but it's even better on my lady so I'll have to pass . . . .

[gegarrenton]

Usually this is the time of year I use Guerlain Vetiver, along with Tom Ford Oud Fleur or MFK Silk Mood.

[andy57]

I have worn Floris for over thirty years. I used to wear No.89 until it got hard to find, 10-15 years ago. Now I mostly wear Elite and occasionally still No.89. Never found a scent I liked on me better than those.